Two Bored Apes - NFT Podcast

Episode 15 - It's All Coming Up BAYC

November 20, 2021 Two Bored Apes
Two Bored Apes - NFT Podcast
Episode 15 - It's All Coming Up BAYC
Show Notes Transcript

On Episode 15 of Two Bored Apes, Jaime and Roy talk about the recent NFT bull run off the back of a lot of great BAYC news, which they also break down. They then have probably their longest Art Blocks segment ever where they slowly fall in love with the 'Asemica' project, and finish by talking a bit about their own projects. Twitter Q&A will now be released as standalone episodes, with the first to come out shortly.

TIMESTAMPS

3:08 News of the Week
13:44 Bored Apes Yacht Club
56:01 Art Blocks
1:38:26 Our Projects

ZenAcademy
Abstract of the Day
BAYC Mobile Game Announcement
Jimmy Fallon joins BAYC
Universal Music launches "Kingship," a band consisting of 3 BAYC and 1 MAYC NFT
Ape In Productions, Timbaland's BAYC Music Project
Asemica, the new Art Blocks Curated project


Jaime:

The hosts of Two Bored Apes are not registered investment advisors. The podcast is for entertainment and informational purposes only. Nothing said on it should be construed as investment advice. This week on Two Bored Apes, we talked about all the interesting stuff happening in the Bored Ape Yatch Club and the bull market that's coming out of those things. We got new big celebrities in, there's the mobile game on roadmap 2.0 coming up, and lots of cool stuff being built. Then we talk about the new curated artblocks drop, and we get into a broader discussion of the artblocks market and generative art in general. Then we talk about our pet projects. And then we're gonna do a separate Twitter q&a episode coming out later this week

Intro:

Two Bored Apes, talking NFT's, De-fi, and some random stuff! uh uh uh uh Two Bored Apes, talking NFT's, De-fi, and some random stuff! uh uh uh uh

Jaime:

Welcome to Episode 15 of Two Bored Apes. I'm your host Jamie and I'm here with my friend and co host, Roy. Roy, how are you?

Roy:

Oh, sorry, I was just finishing a yawn . That's always a good way to start. Um, well. I did have a big meal like an hour ago. As usual. One of us has a giant meal before we record but

Jaime:

a ceremonial pre podcast two big meals

Roy:

had some yuck like mushroom and yucky this tasty creamy sauce. It was good. But yeah. Yeah, doing well. How are you?

Jaime:

I'm good. I'm finally I've been on I. My life has been a whirlwind lately. That's a reference sort of, but anyway, I have been traveling nonstop. And I finally got home last night. And I'm like, starting to live my normal life again, which is kind of nice.

Roy:

Good. And you were in New Orleans. And so that was

Jaime:

the most recent place I was in. Yeah. New Orleans. For my brother in law's 21st birthday. Oh, fun. Yeah, that's cool. He moved down there. Maybe four months ago or something? Yeah. And then turn 21 About a week ago.

Roy:

Yeah. Very exciting.

Jaime:

It is exciting. Yeah, it was fun. And I ate a bunch of delicious food from New Orleans. I drank a bunch of alcohol. And now I'm back home recovering.

Roy:

He's still recovering.

Jaime:

Well, you know how it is when you're going for a while? You gotta like do so. Yeah, you gotta you gotta get your ducks in a row. Mm hmm.

Roy:

Speaking of ducks, I don't know how I'm going to say the next

Jaime:

hour this is going

Roy:

in my head, I was like, thing you will the duck projects, you know, supducks. And it's like a document. Like, we can go from this to NFTs and then some of the usual...

Jaime:

Solana like biggest project is ducks. I really like one of their top three. Yeah.

Roy:

I mean, ducks are great. So yeah,

Jaime:

it's like a very pixelated one. Anyway, should we do the podcast instead of just chatting or

Roy:

let's do some news of the week stuff.

Jaime:

Let's start with the News of the Week. News of the Week. All right, our news of the week is that we had trouble finding a specific news of the week item aside from stuff that directly related to the Bored Ape Yatch Club who had tons of big news.

Roy:

Yeah, and we're gonna get to that and they're in segment but it's just been like, kind of the news of the week for the NFT space...

Jaime:

Did you just the hit a key on a piano?

Roy:

Like my fingernail flicked the stand that my microphone is attached to so maybe...

Jaime:

That sounded kinda nice! Yeah.

Roy:

Yeah, it's just generally it's been a bullish week after what seems like three to four weeks of kind of awful bearishness. I pulled up the F

Jaime:

chart and it looks like for crypto, it's been a bearish week like we Yeah, exact peak basically one week ago on on actual crypto prices. But we are sort of seeing the thing that has been kind of talked about and theorized in the opposite direction on the way up with prices, where the NFT's were struggling where NFT's really have done well this week.

Roy:

Yeah. And it's not... like gas is still high. That was one of the things that had been like kneecapping in the market for the last month and it's still high, but at least on the higher end. And even on the mid end projects. It is thriving now. Cuz I guess market sentiment is returning, and eth is crashing a bit. So it's less expensive in USD terms, I guess. And just generally again, like we'll get to all the bullish news for the board at your club, but there's been a lot of good stuff. Coinbase has just been announcing more and more projects that they're onboarding that will be on the marketplace. Like it's must be like a couple dozen reasonably big projects now and it seems like they're just ramping up and just going to get more and more on there. And there's a lot of excitement about what that will mean for the market. Like those specific projects, but also the market as a whole. And show you the sushi marketplace that launched yesterday, day before.

Jaime:

Yeah, it was yesterday.

Roy:

Did you follow that at all?

Jaime:

I was following it and sort of ready for it when it was two hours out. But then I ended up getting busy doing something else I have not.

Roy:

Yeah, I think I was in a similar situation, where I like I looked at the name like the list of the artists that were going to be released on there to begin with. And I clicked through and had a look at some of the profiles. And I was like, looking at some of the art and then I got distracted and did not actually I had

Jaime:

done that part a long time ago, basically when they announced the artists that they were launching for, but yesterday I was I was kind of getting ready to go on and see if what kind of prices we're looking at and maybe buy something. But then I got distracted with dinner. What else did we want to talk about as potential News of the Week items? Was there anything other than just kind of the general market sentiment?

Roy:

I don't think so. Like it's it's been a good week in NFT Land? Oh, I guess we could talk about the Staples Center sort of renamed Oh, yeah. Branding to crypto.com. That's, I guess, you're probably way more connected to all of that than me. So like, how big is the Staples Center? And how big is this?

Jaime:

Staples Center stadium It's like one of the two biggest venues in Los Angeles. I believe the Lakers play there. And yeah, the Lakers and clippers play there. So it's it's definitely gigantic.

Roy:

And how long? Do you know how long had been the Staples Center for? Um,

Jaime:

let's see. I think 1999 is when it opens. I think it's been the Staples Center the whole time.

Roy:

Wow, that is pretty big, then. Yeah. Now with the crypto.com. Center,

Jaime:

right? capacities, like almost 20,000? And depends on what they're doing. But for basketball, yeah. 19,000.

Roy:

Cool. That's good for crypto...

Jaime:

and Lakers And the clippers are both big teams. So it's yeah, it's just also just obviously a big market in general, regardless of if the teams are good at the time. But right now both good.

Roy:

Yeah. I mean, a lot of people have been talking about like wanting to create a DAO, and then just by sports teams, or a sports team with it. I'm really excited to see

Jaime:

but a lot of talk about that. I'm sure. It will happen relatively soon, with like, a lower tier soccer team in Europe somewhere because there's a zillion of those. Yeah. Um, you could also buy like a farm league team in baseball pretty easily a triple A team, I bet.

Roy:

Yeah, it'll happen. Probably a lot actually. Yeah. It's like DAOs. I mean, they can just raise so much more money than individuals. Oh, yeah.

Jaime:

Yeah. And there's just there's the amount of money in crypto is just it seems like it's only going to be going up at a huge rate of speed for a long time. Whereas these, these lower level professional sports teams are just their prices are not rising. And there's plenty of them. So,

Roy:

but even like, for the bigger ones that cost, I don't know how much they cost 100 million. Yeah. Yeah.

Jaime:

Like, if you want a elite us sports team, it's still only low billions. Yeah. So like, doable for DAOS and stuff...

Roy:

crypto enough wealth and Dallas. But yeah, it's sort of the case where, just the way the DAO's work, it's that fans can now just earn a piece like you could trade the Dow and like someone can buy in for $100. And have just like, whatever that fraction of an ownership rate is into the the DAO. And it's just like, it's in a way where it's like, currently, it's not like a fan can go and buy a piece of the Lakers or whatever it might be. But if it was owned by a DAO, then

Jaime:

there's a couple that you actually can. Oh, yeah. Yeah, like the Green Bay Packers. It's weird, though. Because it's like, the corporate structure of it is that you own it, but you don't actually have any of the ownership. Yeah. But you, you're, you are a shareholder of the Green Bay Packers. It's just yeah, it only means that and not the traditional things that come with being assured voting rights and stuff. Yeah, what? Share of the assets and all whatever. Yeah, um, so Forbes, I'm sure you know, Forbes. They always yearly put out a valuation evaluation of all the top sports teams in the world, basically. Mm hmm. And then when people actually are discussing it a bit more seriously, you tend to add to that because basically every single time a professional sports team has been acquired. It tends to go for like 30 to 50% more than the previous year's valuation, according to Forbes, but according to them the most valuable sports team in the whole world and this might be fun, actually, we're having just saying it. How about you give me a price and a guest for the team?

Roy:

Wow, most valuable sports team in the world. Um I would guess it's either an NFL team or like a soccer slash football team from from Europe. There were my two guesses. And I don't really

Jaime:

neither those as an actual guess. But okay.

Roy:

All right, let's say the

Jaime:

Euros are adjacent to being guesses.

Roy:

New England Patriots and $2 billion.

Jaime:

Okay. It is an NFL team. You got that part? Right. But it's the Dallas Cowboys. And the value is $5.7 billion.

Roy:

Okay, so I was pretty. I was close enough. I'm happy with that. Yeah, I think maybe

Jaime:

in 1989 450 million.

Roy:

That's a hell of a ton. Yeah. Imagine if you bought Bitcoin in 1989.

Jaime:

Yeah, you be you own the world at this point. Yeah. The first soccer team is is the fourth biggest in the world. Barcelona at 4.76 billion

Roy:

are the other top three NFL teams.

Jaime:

No, actually. The second isn't is a baseball team, which is crazy, because nobody likes baseball anymore. But the New York Yankees are number two. Oh, yeah. And then number three is the New York Knicks. Which is basketball. You know, so little, like,

Roy:

I don't know. So I was like, Is that another baseball team? Um, if I thought about it for like, 30 seconds, I would have remembered that in friends. Jerry was always talking about the Knicks and they were like, made that basketball connection. But definitely it's not immediately apparent to me.

Jaime:

Seinfeld, they they talk about sports a decent amount to Jerry's a big Mets fan.

Roy:

Yeah, that's why the obviously the Yankees a lot. Yeah,

Jaime:

because George works with them. Um, but anyway, those are, those are all numbers that crypto people can rustle up to? Yeah, spend on something and let I'm just gonna kind of scroll down to a still an elite team, but not top five or whatever. Something like the Boston Celtics, my basketball team, they're tied for 25th According to them at 3.2 billion. So I mean, these are all not. Not cheap, obviously. No. But what is? What is Bitcoin worth? Like? A little over a trillion?

Roy:

Yeah. And also you just get like, Yeah, you get doubt. Like, again, going back to the Dogecoin. Example. Again, if you compare it in a Doge, everything's cheap, but you do get meme coin. Yeah.

Jaime:

Literally, if everybody in Doge, like somehow all dumped on theoretical people that wanted to buy.

Roy:

Yeah, they go buy just top five, they can buy the top 10 sports teams in the whole world. Of the amazing, man. Come on Doge community. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that is the power locks

Jaime:

could easily have a triple A baseball team in Texas near Marfa. If they want to do it

Roy:

would be cool. Yeah. I mean, the artblocks like just the collectors, that and some of the whales there. They just have such

Jaime:

a jdh could probably just buy the Cowboys. Yo. That's an exaggeration, everyone. This isn't a news, though, right? Let's think so. Yeah. Yeah. Once the next Bull Run comes, it will not be but right now it is. Yeah. Alright. Let's get let's get to the real news in the Bored Ape Yatch Club.

Roy:

Well, let's close out the segments. We can write a little jingle in

Jaime:

News of the Week. Roy.

Roy:

Jamie?

Jaime:

Let's talk about the Bored Ape Yatch Club. Who baby? What do we got a lot to talk about?

Roy:

What a week.

Jaime:

Do you want to do the jingle? Bored Ape Yatch Club! That was not as good as Twitter q&a or news of the week as it?

Roy:

No, I don't think so. We are not very musical. We are not musical at all.

Jaime:

So the overarching theme is that it's been an insanely bullish week for the Bored Ape Yatch Club. And there's various pieces of news that have been precipitating that I think, but the overall thing is holy cow did the prices of all three pieces. That would be the eight, the mutants and the dogs rally like crazy this week.

Roy:

Yeah, I think the full price for apes almost doubled in a week, which is kind of insane when you consider like what it was already out like 20 eth, 25 to 30 eth.

Jaime:

And they've officially eclipsed the all time high now that we had back when we were in like Barcelona,

Roy:

in USD terms, 100% current, pure eth terms not quite. But the dam

Jaime:

was getting vaguely close to that to their way it's still over 50 Right.

Roy:

It's at 51 right now and I think all time high like peak For a moment it like 60 to 64. Yeah. But obviously that, like, that was a mutual value. Yeah. So mutants now was the day that the mutants were dropping. Yeah. And yeah, he was probably like 2k. At the time, maybe two and a half. I don't remember exactly, but not 4k plus. So it was more like two and a half. Yeah. Anyway, so it's just yeah, it's been a crazy week off the back of multiple bits of news. I think the thing that sort of started and kicked it off was last week. Has we mentioned UMG, Universal Music Group signed for a piece of the band, and then sort of since then, it's been bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, more news. Often more news. Surely,

Jaime:

biggest? Yeah, those I was gonna interview on Jimmy Fallon moonpay really been getting a lot of big names into it. And Jimmy Fallon is sort of the biggest yet. I guess it kind of depends on what sphere you're in. But he has 51 million Twitter followers, which is like that puts him as one of the top accounts on all of Twitter.

Roy:

Yes, larmy. Just add to that, he has 51 point 3 million. So a rounding error to him is the entire market of NFT's at the moment more than like, there are 300,000 people buying and selling and he has 51 point, he didn't even say the point three, he has 51 million. The rounding error is more than I was probably 51

Jaime:

When he got the gain 300,000 Since you had the entire gravitational attraction. Yeah, that is huge. He's the host of The Tonight Show, which I guess is not quite as big of a deal. But it used to be the biggest deal in like all of showbusiness. Johnny Carson was like, that was such a huge el turtle thing for so long deal is a big 1 million is insane.

Roy:

It really isn't like, and it's not like he just like initially, it was he just mentioned on the show that he got one. But then he tweeted twice about it. He was like, I don't know. Welcome aboard.

Jaime:

about it now. Yeah, each something that you profile to it. And he's actually following a bunch of them on Twitter, which most He's following me, which is really cool. Yeah. And follow me at Jimmy.

Roy:

Well, did you tweet at him?

Jaime:

I don't think so. But particularly Carrie there. Yeah. And then Post Malone got in. And he's at the beginning of his new music video with the weekend. They're both huge. And I'm sure you don't know who either of them are. Because you are who you are.

Roy:

I have heard the names before. Thank you very much. Congratulate

Jaime:

congratulate. But the very beginning of the music video Post Malone is buying his new eight. I saw that yeah, that's what it's like, that is crazy.

Roy:

Yeah, I just I just pulled up Jimmy, Jimmy's Twitter. And two hours ago, he tweeted, named my eight drop your session suggestions below Bored Ape Yatch Club #bayc. Etc. Wow.

Jaime:

So he's gone for it.

Roy:

Yeah. So tell us a bit more about what MoonPay is and what they do, because I only have a very brief understanding.

Jaime:

And I might have less, honestly. Okay. I just know that lately. A ton of people that are celebrities that have been getting apes have been getting it through them. And so people kind of have been watching their wallet now. And when they buy an ape, it's exciting to people in the community because they're wondering, who is this one for? But according to what Jimmy said, on The Tonight Show, he basically just said they are like PayPal for crypto. So I think it basically allows people to buy crypto assets with regular fiat currency in a very smooth, easy way. Yeah. Whereas like, theoretically, if you wanted to buy an eight, and you were using Coinbase, you'd have to buy the eth then send the eth to like a Metamask wallet. And whereas with Moonpay, you can just go okay, this ape costs $200,000. I would like it here you go and do it in one fell swoop. Yeah. That's so much less friction than doing it the other

Roy:

Absolutely. Yeah, it's, um, it's perfect for I guess, quote, way I described. unquote, normies. Or just people who are not familiar with the ecosystem and don't want to either take the time to understand or take the risk of doing it and screwing something up. Because it is sort of like this steep learning curve at the moment. I'm on that Twitter page. Now it says what they do is payment infrastructure for crypto. So yeah,

Jaime:

one of one of the things we've talked about before is that just one of the hurdles to mass adoption and stuff like that is the friction of buying. And yeah, knowing what gas is and like, just for instance, if you think of somebody that was going to do it the old way, and they just had a tiny bit of help and they go okay, I'm gonna buy this eight for 70 or whatever. They go through this pretty long and arduous process, honestly, of setting up a coin base, buying 70 eth worth sending it to Coinbase to a metamask while and then going to buy and then they find out they're like, you know, .05 eth short because of gases like, yeah, just that kind of thing. Never, never mind having to set up metamask and knowing how it works and having to deal with all the stuff that got them to that point. Yeah. Whereas this, it can kind of just abstract all that away for people.

Roy:

Yeah. So it seems like they've been sort of a lot of celebrities have been using Moonpay to get apes and potentially other things.

Jaime:

Yeah. And it seems also like Moonpay is using the celebrities to get their name out. Like, it's I'm not sure the exact finances of how it's working. And this is sort of an interesting thing to me where, you know, I hear a lot of people talking generally negatively about celebrities getting into the space and stuff like that, just because it seems like it's so opportunistic and stuff. But the way I'm seeing it is that if we're sort of all right about how transformative this technology is, how fun it is, how valuable and powerful all these communities are, even if people come in for slightly more cynical reasons and stuff. Like, if we're right, we will capture them, and turn them into actual appreciators of NFT's, and decentralization and all that good stuff. And, you know, it's not going to happen for all of them. But unless we're totally wrong about all of this, it's definitely going to happen for some of them.

Roy:

Yeah, definitely. Like, we've said this before, it's like no one, almost no one buys just one NFT. Like, you get very difficult to get the bug, you enjoy it. It's exciting. It's fun, it's new, it's interesting. It's this hot pot of culture, and art, and tech, and finance, and, you know, even if a celebrity is getting in, and their intention is, hey, I want to release my own NFT. And they have the PR person saying, Hey, you should buy an ape and you know, just look like you're in the community, I would say a good percentage of the time, they end up just loving the community and buying more NFT's and learning about it. And yes, some of them will probably just cash grab and leave the space. And that is obviously not a thing that we love to see or want to encourage. But I think a good percentage of them just are understanding what's happening and excited to be involved with it. And yes, maybe they are releasing their own entity, maybe they're not, maybe they will in the future. But they are bringing just attention to and bring it to so many new eyes and audiences and legitimising, I guess, in a way, which is cool to see.

Jaime:

Yeah, for sure. I mean, you know, again, when you're talking about that rounding error, that's, that's such an interesting thing, when you, when you sort of think about the growth rate of people knowing about it, or or seeing it, it's just, there's literally millions and millions of new people every single week being being just shown, sort of the value, or what various people that their fans think the value of all of this is, you know, and, and it's just because of the way distribution works on the internet, and stuff like that, it's it seems like it can really be an explosive curve of, of people being exposed to it and adopting it.

Roy:

Yeah, like we're already starting to see that. But it has obviously hasn't quite reached much mass adoption yet for all sorts of other reasons. But at least it's getting that level of exposure where

Jaime:

and then Coinbase is gonna be another huge show. Yeah, more

Roy:

and more people are just getting aware of NFT's and know what they are kind of, even if they have a negative perception of it, at least they know what they are. It's like that is the first step to true mass adoption. And you know, there'll always be people that are oppose anything like whether it's a paradigm shift, a tech change, people are just opposed to change. And then there's, you know, people with environmental concerns, and then there's this whole wave of, I guess we could talk about the news of the week the the war on the right, click Save. Is that like Vincent vendo? And oh, yes, absolutely gonna fun been taking. But yeah, I mean, there's a lot of people out there who were just opposed to NFTs. But at least they're aware of them. And like, it's the conversations, sort of like, I guess, there's no publicity of suffer. Like, there's no such thing as bad publicity. And, yeah, you know, it's getting out there. And then a lot of people, but you know, some people will be seeing all this back and forth. And rather than just believing what the people who are negative about it say, they will go and do some research on their own. And I hope you heard, we hope and think that a good amount of them will understand what is happening and sort of come over to our side or not that this side, but like just see things from our perspective and see what's happening. And yeah, and that's how the whole pie grows. And we all sort of benefit from that.

Jaime:

Yeah, we actually have we have a Twitter q&a coming up that also kind of has sort of a more individual version of this talking But the Thanksgiving question that one's kind of interesting, just as another example of, of the proliferation of this kind of information, and the ideas, but I think another thing is, I've talked about this a few times on here, the difference between an NFT and a picture file, and how, you know, is there such a common misunderstanding of people that are not in this space that an NFT literally just is a picture file. And then, of course, that makes it very sort of legitimate to think of right click saving as just a complete negation of the whole concept. Yeah. But I think like, specifically, if you're talking about the Bored Ape Yatch Club, we're seeing more and more how it's, it's acting as an access token, rather than just the picture itself. Because you know, and when you think of the first thing, initially, a lot of those rewards are just air drops of more NFT's. And so the people that don't believe in it are not going to go, what's not just a picture file, like, I'm not buying the idea that it's more than a picture file, if the benefits it's getting you is more of these picture files that I don't believe in, that doesn't really get people to convert, but then you had, like the treasure hunt, that was a legitimate thing. And then you had the Ape fest, that was a legitimate thing. And now we have this mobile game coming up that we didn't even talk about yet. We're going to be talking about in a minute. And you're just seeing more and more examples of what you know, NFTs theoretically could do, we're getting more and more examples of them actually doing that, rather than just being again, you know, the JPEG that people who are not into them think of them as

Roy:

Yeah, I mean, I would say the biggest one of that is probably a fist like this 1000 person yacht party, this warehouse party, with great acts and lineups, like just having this JPEG, this NFT this token, just got you free access to these things. And it's like that's real tangible value, and awesomeness and cool stuff that other people outside the community can relate to. And like, you know, people are going to be sharing on Facebook or Twitter or whatever, Instagram, social media they have and with their friends and their family and people are on in the space. And like, you're on 1000 person yacht on the Hudson, I think it was in New York, how, like, how are you there? How did life lead you to this point to being on 1000 person yacht? And then you get the conversation? Oh, well, I have this NFT I wasn't just a JPEG? Well, yeah, it kind of is, but there's so much more. And then that's how the conversation begins. And I think we're gonna see more of that. Obviously, as time goes on, and as more sort of integration happens between NFT and like, quote, unquote, real world stuff, it doesn't necessarily have to be, you know, face to face, there's online real world stuff, too, that's just not strictly NFT speaking, but benefits that that can come.

Jaime:

And I think, as we get more of these games that tons of people are working on, that'll be another good example, you'll probably see instances where there's games that lots of people that don't have the NFT's are playing, but then they'll sort of see this nice advantage that other people have in the game, because of some NFT's that they own, that interact with the game, and, and sort of power up their character or what whatever, it'll become more of a legitimate thing. And, you know, a lot of gamers are already used to that sort of thing. But where it's just stuff that you don't actually own it, it's just in a database and owned by the company, and they can take it away from you whenever you want. Now, you're getting those same sort of benefits within the game, but with a true sense of ownership. And then if you get sick of a game, or you need the money, you can just sell the NFT to somebody else that's still into it, and still wants that extra extra benefit to their character.

Roy:

Yeah, I just found out about a project a couple days ago, high rise, it's, it's like this mobile app where it's like this high rise building, and people have their own rooms. And it's like this meeting place social media, like, kinda like a little Metaverse, and they have 13 million users. It's like a mobile app and stuff. And they're launching an NFT now on ImmutableX, which I don't know exactly what it is, if you get your own room, or you get some, but it'll be sort of the case where people in the game will be able to see that these other users who have the NFT's either have a special room or have these special outfits or benefits and that's like and then we'll start to see oh hang on this value that because you know currently people that play this game in the app, they spend you know money to buy whatever in game assets and apparently it's expensive this game so that's one of the complaints a lot of people have is expensive, but if you can, I guess at least have the the cost in the form of an NFT that you then earn and again can resell can attend potentially, like make profit on then it just really opens up this massive new world and yeah, it's it's awesome. And we're just at the tip of the iceberg still.

Jaime:

Yeah, so speaking of games and the Bored Ape Yatch Club, why don't we talk about the Bored Ape Yatch Club versus maybe Mutant Ape Yatch Club mobile competition game that we just got the teaser video of.

Roy:

Yeah. So part of roadmap 2.0 was like mobile game and we didn't really know too much more about it. And then yesterday, the day before the yoga labs just tweeted out this trailer video of Yeah, it was Bored Ape Yatch Club versus Mutant Ape Yatch Club and like 20 seconds of gameplay of a game that looked fun. It's like, This looks awesome.

Jaime:

Yeah, it was like the The Binding of Isaac to me. Yes, yes. I don't know enough about genres to know exactly what that's called a dungeon crawler or something. Something

Roy:

some like indie game? Yeah, just

Jaime:

we have very few details. But again, on roadmap 2.0, it says BAYC And then there's an X MAYC. So it does sort of seem like it's a competition with one pitted against the other, which is sort of interesting, especially since every single ape sort of has a mutant or at least had the chance to have a mutant. But then there's a bunch more mutants. And we saw like, in the trailer, you saw, for instance, the apes that have a piece of pizza coming out of their mouth, they were shooting out a bunch of pizzas, we saw some of the mega mutants, like the electrical one, seeming to be able to use electricity. So it's, it's very intriguing. And I'm curious to see how what, what the format is we know it's 10 days. And we know a little bit what it looks like. But that's about it.

Roy:

Yeah. It's exciting. Like it's, yeah, you said that, like, soon you'll just going to your job is going to be playing a video game for

Jaime:

10 days, it seems like my, the legitimate best use of my time, professionally speaking, will be to play a video game. And I'm thrilled with that. Yeah. beyond thrilled. Really.

Roy:

Yeah. That's it sounds awesome and fun. And it's, again, another cool use case of NFT's. And yeah, it's again, it's another case of Hugo labs, absolutely crushing it in execution and innovation. Like they part of that initial roadmap wasn't a game, it wasn't a big promise, even roadmap 2.0 It wasn't like, a huge deal. It was just this little, again, little thing on the roadmap, none of us really knew what it was. And then they just come out with this. What is about to be look looking like a fully functioning, fun and engaging game to play. Which other projects have been promising for months, maybe years.

Jaime:

there's 11 things on roadmap 2.0 Aside from the not listed stuff in the bottom left. So basically 1/11 of the roadmap was Ape Fest 1/11 of it is this awesome looking game coming out? Amazing. And there's all this other stuff. They're building a clubhouse in Miami, right?

Roy:

No, that's just crazy. Yeah.

Jaime:

And so there's more though, like, how much do you know about this timberland thing? I know very little. But it sounds very relevant. But I do wish I knew more.

Roy:

Yeah, I don't know too much about it. I know that there's a

Jaime:

timberland is a is a very big music producer in in hip hop and r&b starts there. I know that

Roy:

there's a NFT project or platform called ape in productions. And I think what they're trying to do is like an be an entertainment company, owned by artists in the community and stuff like that. And it's been founded by a whole bunch of apes like on their website, they have like 16 Apes as it's earned by. And yeah, timberland has come on board, as I don't know if if he's one of the owners, or if he's just like collaborating with them. But obviously, it's a huge name that they've got. And it's just this news came out this week, as well. So we're between Universal Music Group between Jimmy Fallon, between Post Malone between this, it's just like, mainstream adoption and awareness of the Apes is happening and cool stuff is happening. And more and more people are seeing it. And, again, we're still at the beginning. So I mean, that's kind of the extent of what I know about the Timberland and ape in production use.

Jaime:

Yeah, that's, that's even more than I know. I would like to look into it more though.

Roy:

Yeah. I mean, they're selling or they sold a selling, I think still a NFT. .25 eth is the cost. And I think there's 3000 of them. I don't really know the details of what it involves or what you get from it. But yeah, it's just another potential cool use case of NFT. If you get, you know, ownership in this company, or this Dao, I guess if they're building a dowel

Jaime:

Yeah, that I'm so excited about this game, though. Yeah, the game looks very cool. And that's also only one of two games that's on the roadmap 2.0 There's also the blockchain one, which seems to be coming along quite a bit later on the roadmap,

Roy:

man apes just gonna take over the world like

Jaime:

it's kind of seems like it yeah I can't believe I only have one What a bummer I wish I wish I could have seen the vision more clearly when they were still cheap. Yeah I didn't have any money then because yeah I got most of my bankroll from being able to slowly sell some artblock stuff and it hadn't really started going up well for so cheap. Yeah. All my all my NFT's went up at the exact same time. So unlucky. Oh, yeah. Yeah, no, I could have compounded better if I had one year up and sold it and then bought another one up.

Roy:

Yeah. Oh, what a year. It's been Yeah.

Jaime:

That's a very big understatement. I know

Roy:

what NFT's were a year ago. I definitely did not.

Jaime:

I did not Yeah, I don't think so. At least I might have first heard about them in October or something, but I don't actually specifically remember when my friends first started me telling me about them. Right definitely. For a long time.

Roy:

Yeah. Remember when a friend a mutual friend that we keep referring to who wouldn't say by name but was telling us about what she

Jaime:

would just docs himself so yeah, we could say

Roy:

yeah, I think it was like bull run babes. Was this like small run names was the first one Yeah, it was like such a fight another NFT you get to level two. You were telling me about it. And I was like genuinely concerned. Or getting scammed. What is 1000s Oh my god. And yeah, yeah, I think a lot of

Jaime:

people don't realize he was just a genius although that one did well not be a very successful project.

Roy:

Yeah, that specific one but definitely crypto punks. Hash masks even have really come back and

Jaime:

yeah HashMaps prices and forever blocks he goes into blocks Yep,

Roy:

we owe everything to him basically. A lot large pot Yeah, that's

Jaime:

so I'm gonna talk about roadmap 2.0 again for a second so yes, it's kind of got like this river thing and so far it's gone in order if you starting at the bottom left and follow the river but they said in the discord the other day that you shouldn't sort of expect it to go in order but that the BAYC X MAYC mobile competition was up next so i i We can't actually expect if it was to just keep following the river the trail of Jimmy the monkey would be the next thing up but I I'm not so confident that that's coming up next. All right, I'm looking at even know what half of this stuff is.

Roy:

I know nd verse MMI. Like the battle that

Jaime:

one. There was a lot of talk about what those stood for. If you looked around, it seemed like mech dog versus maybe mech mutant some Yeah. I don't remember what people thought the I ended up standing for though. But the tracer hunt that seems like it's maybe just another another treasure hunt but maybe tracer sponsoring it or something like that. I don't. I don't know. Yeah,

Roy:

it could involve like hardware wallets located.

Jaime:

They I that's what I was just thinking that would be amazing. Yeah. What do you know what that thing's called? geocaching? Yeah, yeah. It could be something like that. That would be fucking cool. I hope it's in good providence.

Roy:

I can see it being like literally all around the world. And people have to work together. Yeah,

Jaime:

that's a hard thing for them to keep a secret you'd think.

Roy:

Yeah, but I mean, they're pretty good at Secrets. It's AR that just got released amazing things. I saw a bit of that NFT.NYC I know the doodles had like this. They hid a couple of hardware wallets. Or, or just like, notes with seed phrases. I remember exactly what it was on the Highline. I think it is somewhere along there in New York City. And yeah, they just sort of like tweeted out. Hey, friends in New York, here are a couple of clues go hunting, and there's a doodle on each one of them. Which was unknown one or two eth at the time. And just a cool little in real life type treasure hunt. And then they had to tweet out please don't go climbing and tramping on all the trees and plants because people were just getting very overzealous searching for this thing. And yeah, I can see it being in real life treasure hunt, like a hybrid. Oh, my crazy Oh, hunt. So the DAO that's another thing that's on this roadmap, the BAYC ecosystem. They've they've mentioned that they're working towards a token and they're trying to do it correctly, and it's looking likely to be q1 2022. So I think that's something that we have to look forward to in the next. What is it? One and a half to four and a half months? She's very exciting to me.

Jaime:

Yeah, it will be. So to me, the most likely thing is that it'll be interacting with the blockchain game, but I'm also one Wondering if possibly they are trying to, I have no idea but they might try to be selling merch to the public, and then having a polders be able to buy merch just with tokens that they're sort of generating. Because it seems like they're making so much money from secondary royalties that they don't necessarily need to actually charge us, for us to be buying shirts and shit like that. But the most clear thing to me is that it will interact with the blockchain game. That seems like the most obvious use case for the token.

Roy:

I think so. But like, there's so many possibilities they could even do. Yeah, that sort of said that they're not gonna release more NFT's into the ecosystem, like mutants was the last of it. Right? I don't know, maybe they can create a new ecosystem that isn't quite bored at your club is like, something completely new. That's like born out of the body of your club. And it's just a separate entity. And then we just get benefits through that system. And people are like, well, it's sort of like, adjacent to the body of your club. But it's not the same ecosystem. It's its own thing. And because it's run by the same team, it people are very hyped and bullish about it. And there's value created, basically, when you come and want to get involved and existing members are getting some value from, I don't know, breeding in it or something like that.

Jaime:

I've never even heard of such a theory. And it sounds insane. To me. It's all insane. And I'm betting I'm betting the no on that theater. Yeah. We'll small in on the now. Yeah.

Roy:

I mean, why it would be cool if they just did like more breeding like, like with cyber comes. They have the breeding as a reward for the or use case for the utility token bananas. And the reason it's valuable is because the ecosystem is valuable, and people want to be part of the cons. Clearly, the Bored Ape Yatch Club ecosystem is enormously valuable. And if they could structure it in a way where it wasn't over flooding or saturating the market, and there was only like a small Yeah, it

Jaime:

seems like such a dangerous game to to make a consistently increasing supply like

Roy:

that. They mean, they could do it in a way where it's like,

Jaime:

with incentive for selling to the holders to get value out of their existing stuff.

Roy:

Yeah, but it could be like diminishing returns. So over time, it gets harder to add new people or something like that.

Jaime:

Yeah. It is so interesting to see. Like, how, how they plan on growing within the NFT space, specifically, if they're not planning to add more NFT's to it. That is sort of an interesting conundrum. Although they still have a lot. I mean, what is there? 30 39,000? Something basically NFT's. Yeah, in the ecosystem? That's a good number. Yeah. And but it does already have very good distribution. So the most new unique users they can add without adding new NFTs is only like another 7000 or something, maybe?

Roy:

Yeah, especially because there are a lot of owners and multiple that just do not want to sell any. Like I have, I have zero intention of selling any of my three. Kind of ever, but like, right

Jaime:

at four weeks ago, you were flirting with selling I know. But

Roy:

yeah, I wanted to sell one to invest into like a bundle. It's funny to

Jaime:

me, that was the same week where I was going, I think I want to make a second.

Roy:

Yeah. But um, can we consider just like the value and benefits that you can probably get just passively by holding one? Like, yeah, they've already given us the dog, the mutant, the potential value from the the treasure hunt, the like, just the the utility and IRL value of these Ape Fest and all those activities Yeah, it's likely that

Jaime:

nevermind what you're getting from other things like bato and stuff. Oh, yeah,

Roy:

that too, and what other projects will do and also just the network effect? Like, how many Twitter followers do people get just by right? And it's not like random Twitter followers that you get by paying a bot it's like these dedicated people in the NFT community that it's so it's so much easier to grow a Twitter following from 2000 to 10,000 then probably even from zero to 2000. And yeah, getting an ape just boost to their

Jaime:

Twitter following of people that are in engaged and interested in the exact same thing. You seemingly are.

Roy:

Yeah, and I mean, you can definitely get it by getting other profile pictures like every community has this rule follow everyone within the community but none of it seems quite as strong as Ape follow Ape.

Jaime:

Yeah, and well, and also the the way that they've added the mutants and made them basically also just their flat out they're considered apes. Yeah. It's so much bigger than Whatever other project is trying to get that same network effect, yeah, with their 10,000 pieces instead of 30.

Roy:

Yo. Alright. We love the apes. We know that this is a big week. It has been a big, big week.

Jaime:

I want to, I want to look at that tweet and just try and see what they mean by soon for the whole game. Like, am I gonna get to start playing it tomorrow? How soon is this mobile game competition? They just use the word soon. So it's a 10 day members only event and it's soon as of two days ago. That could be Oh, my God. I really, I really want to play. Yeah. But that could be any day now.

Roy:

It really could be. And it is exciting. I, I probably won't be able to play a lot of it. But I want to I I just really want to play it. And I think I will be able to Yeah. societally. Here you are something people have been talking about is like they've been talking for ages. But more and more this last week is the possibility of apes flipping punks. And I think both like four months ago, I basically went on record and tweet and replied to a bunch of people saying, I love the apes. I'm a huge, but I don't see them ever flipping punks. And now I've just sort of changed my mind, like just seeing the network effect and the momentum and everything of this last week, this last month with Ape Fest and kind of the lack of any sort of equivalent engagement from larva labs in the punks. Um, I think they

Jaime:

are at an all time high as a percentage of Yeah,

Roy:

I think so too.

Jaime:

They're almost 60% of the for value right now.

Roy:

Yeah, yeah. They get in there. And yeah, I think it's gonna happen.

Jaime:

I could definitely see it happening. It does. You know, because if you look at like, what is the value proposition of crypto punks, versus what is the value proposition of apes? I think that the people that care about the value proposition of crypto punks have largely already arrived, right? They've already been in the crypto space. And the, the alternatives to it that are still sort of following the same. Let me think of how to phrase this. But like, basically, if you're thinking of it as value, because it's a historical NFT. I think there's a lot of ones that are equally if not more historical, I mean, for sure, there are ones that are earlier, we know that now, there's people that are staring at the blockchain and looking at all this old shit. And there's lots of other projects from around that time and earlier that other people could go, well, the punks have already zoomed up to 400,000. But I still want to invest for historical purposes into early NFTs. There's a lot of other options. Whereas if you're trying to go for sort of the new wave, web 3.0, company, network effects type thing. I think that there's not as good of ways necessarily to try and pick a, another competitor to the apes, as well as, as we go further and further out into the future. If you're sort of thinking about historical NFT's the difference, I think, to a lot of people between how historical punk is versus how historical an ape is, is going to shrink.

Roy:

Suddenly from like, if you zoom out decades, then I think that that's fairly accurate. Yeah, I mean,

Jaime:

especially if you're looking at like the potential of what an NFT can do, because the punks really are just nothing, you know what I mean? It's it's a historical thing. It's, it means that you are rich, or we're in early or whatever. But they don't have a use case. There's there's nothing to them. Whereas you go Labs is very actively, consistently just doing stuff. You might not like the stuff, that's fine. It's not necessarily for you then. But it's hard for more people to get converted into crypto punks. That can't just easily go, Well, maybe I'll just get some rare Pepys and said, or some curio card, yeah, or some ether rocks, or all of these other old things, in the same way that I don't think people can just substitute a lot of these other projects for apes.

Roy:

I agree with that. But I would say that a lot of I mean apes and like just the this profile picture avatar thing. I don't think there's an equal in terms of historical projects that everything was inspired from in the way that everything has been inspired by the punks like this 10k generative collection, everything since then. is in that area, like, comes from Punx. They did set the standard they did have,

Jaime:

like, did they were like, I'm not I'm not, I'm not even that sure about that anymore. Like, I guess, if you want to say, you can say, you know, generative and 10k sort of goes back to them. But after that I feel like a ton of the way that they're structured and the roadmaps that they're doing, and the way that the communities are behaving. Is them copying apes and not punks?

Roy:

Oh, yeah. Everything like this year, I think is a lot of people copying apes like getting inspired from apes. But I would say that punks inspired. I mean, punks inpired by a designer for an OG looks punks, probably inspired a lot of other projects. And that I think, will always hold. I mean, obviously, the crypto gees and NFT OG's view punks very highly. Here, it's hard to imagine like I can also see a situation where larva labs just sort of comes out and just drops an enormous announcement like the meebits nowhere so common,

Jaime:

that I very much think is a legit possibility. And that was huge

Roy:

news. And the entire space was buzzing about it. And then obviously, in time, it sort of faded as 1000s of other more cool and exciting things happen. And nothing really happened on the Meebits front. But, you know, they have an enormous war chest, they they've been builders in this space for a long time. And I could see them just dropping something completely mind blowing and crazy that.

Jaime:

Definitely, I see that as well. Yeah, I I'm just I'm more thinking about the concept of the growth of this space, and the new people and new money that come in, what, what is cool to them, and what matters to them. And what are they aspiring to when they get in? And I think as time goes on, it just feels to me less and less like the answer to those questions will be punks. And more like the answer will be apes.

Roy:

Yeah, I largely agree with that. I do think though, as the Yeah, I mean, I do think punks sorry, he will flip punks, but it's once the prices start getting close, I can definitely see a lot of AP earners and holders like a good amount being like, I could sell my ape and get a punk and some of them will definitely take that. And yeah, yeah. And yeah, it's also like,

Jaime:

but I mean, how many? How many punk holders are getting worried and going? Hmm, maybe this is the last minute that I can actually trade my punk for an eight. That's where I can trade my for punk for a good eight. We feel like they're ascending. And maybe the punks feel like they're stagnating? Like, yeah, it goes both ways. And the distribution of the punks versus the apes. I think that there's a lot more a polders with one, whereas there's more people that are kind of hoarding the punk still.

Roy:

Yeah, that's very true. There's a lot of people with like 2050 Plus punks.

Jaime:

Maybe not a lot, and only a handful. If you're doing that with apes.

Roy:

Yeah, there's really not that many. There's almost 6000 unique ape owners at the 10,000 which is, is wild, like the supply crunch is really coming and fast.

Jaime:

I'm also sort of wondering, like, I we were, we were talking about this in our in our group chat yesterday. I'm wondering how many of the people that have punks and have had punks for a while are they're not necessarily that into NFT specifically, perhaps. And they're more into just decentralization and crypto in general. And also, we're just so early that they have so much money, they can just kind of stick them in defi farms, and do whatever the heck they want for their lives. Whereas the apes feels like it's a little bit more of like, newer, hungrier NFT specific money in a way that will make them kind of just care more about growing. Yeah, no, that's a really good like actively and building. Yeah,

Roy:

I mean, we definitely definitely see that where a lot of punk holders are just they don't care about the community aspect so much they don't care about networking with other punk holders and improving the brand of the punks either they they also are wealthy already. They have their own projects that because they've been in this space for years that like pouring all their energy into whatever their own project is. And yeah, in a way with the apes, there's just a lot more hunger and people are like innovating and finding new cool things to do like the record label we just talked about, like we spoken about people creating a like what you mentioned before someone with the apes is making like unique merch or or something that is selling the hoodie that

Jaime:

expand. Yeah, he has a clothing line uses various apes.

Roy:

Yeah, there you go. And then there's coffee coffee labels using apes. There's, there's just so much Ziering, a beer brand is, is obviously Jenkins of LA is now I think that that's us, Neil Strauss.

Jaime:

I don't know if we did a news of the week, but that would have been relevant to New York Times bestselling author, Neil Strauss is going to be right in the first book of that. Oh, I didn't know that. That's now you know,

Roy:

that's no, no, that's cool. Yeah, it does seem like apes have taken over the world and well, good to be in a polder, I guess? It is.

Jaime:

Showing the longest ever eight segment?

Roy:

I think so that was been a big week. So we should move on before this turns into a five hour podcast?

Jaime:

Yes. All right. Already got our plots. Right, what's been going on in our blocks?

Roy:

Well, we're back in to the swing of things with curated drops. So we had Edifis last week. And then we had another one this week. assamica by Emily Edelman, Deema Hoffman and Andrew beta.

Jaime:

So I guess the three PRs one project,

Roy:

which might be the first curated drop with multiple artists,

Jaime:

it's hard to know because like stuff like Union grades is bi Z blocks. And it's like, Who or what is the blocks? Yeah, unclear.

Roy:

We've certainly had a ton of other like factory and playground projects with multiple artists collaborating, but anyway, um, yeah. So I guess let's touch on edifice a bit that we spoke about a bit last week. We both loved it. It looked beautiful. And then it sold out. I think 2.4 eth. And kind of hovered there for a little while. And then maybe two or three days ago just rocketed up to a floor of around six. Yes, I guess more people like

Jaime:

just before I was able to get one on.

Roy:

One. It's come down a bit. So like for 4.8. Now, but still. Yeah, I guess the general market sentiment changed a bit people are feeling a bit more bullish. And then when that happens, or when there's a drop that people really, really love, that's when I can start to take off. So that's basically what happened. I'm looking at them now. They really are pretty.

Jaime:

I'm still I'm trying to trade for one. Even though I missed the boat on buying one. I thought there's two. Last time I talked about it. I really liked the couch color palette, but I also liked the sunflower one. So I'm trying to acquire one from either one of those, and then I'll be happy.

Roy:

Yeah. Anyway, so that was at first and then this week was Seneca, Seneca, which it sold out at two eth. And kind of almost very quickly, slush immediately just started dropping on secondary. And it's now sitting at point 558. So that's sort of a huge loss slash drop, at least on paper for anyone who minted for the average one, at least, I haven't checked them with the rarer ones have sold for. And I think part of that is just a lot of people, minting expecting the same thing to happen to this as what happened with edifice No, like, it's another curated drop off blocks is back, yay. Let's make a new quickly flip it up. And it didn't perhaps consider it from the perspective of whether they whether they liked the art themselves. And we're happy to hold whether they thought other people would like the art and the sort of appeal it might have. And it was just a lot of speculation. And yeah, I mean, I guess we're seeing what happens when, when a lot of people buy in based on speculation and looking for profit, and not necessarily just to hold the art and

Jaime:

what was the lowest price that the Dutch auction was meant to go to? It was supposed to get below two, right? They usually go down to like point five or something.

Roy:

Yeah, I'm

Jaime:

gonna sneeze. Because it's not coming. It's not. This is unpleasant. Yeah. Let's talk about what the project actually is, though. Maybe? Yeah. It's it's basically, they're trying to do typography of not actual letters from any specific language, it's just supposed to basically be evocative of lettering. And it's very good at that. And it also like a lot of them will look sort of like an article basically, where you have sort of like a big pullquote that takes up a lot of space and then around it is like the regular parts of the columns. Whereas other ones are sort of just showing you like maybe what the alphabet would look like. And it's sort of just like a grid of, of 20 letters and then other ones. It kind of is so abstracted away from the lettering that it just kind of becomes very much like a pattern, a repetitious pattern of the same thing over and over again. And then other ones are like one or two giant letters, it's like it's got an interesting amount of variety in in the way the pieces are. And I bet if you're like, there must be some typography nuts out there. And they must think that this is like the most amazing generative art ever, I have never been a person who like cared about fonts and letters in general. So it's not something that's particularly interesting to me on an individual piece basis. But as I scroll through the project, it does seem like a well made generative project in terms of the variety and the theme, that's letting you know that they're all related. But there also is huge variety at the sort of the far ends of the algorithm.

Roy:

Mm hmm. I think that's a really good overview of it. I, I probably care a little bit more than most, like in terms of the appeal that I get from touch, typography and letters and this kind of stuff. So I actually, I didn't mean largely because I was completely busy inside truckload stuff. And then someone told me, Hey, did you miss a meeting, and then I sold the message, like three hours offered already sold out. So I guess fortunate for me, because it sold out at two. And I probably would have mentioned one, at least at that price. And then now I sort of have the luxury of going through the secondary market and finding the ones that really appealed to me. And so the ones that you were mentioning where it's like, it looks like a newspaper where there's a big article in the middle and then like lettering around or like something like that, that is that those types really appealed to me. And also those ones, those were my favorites. I think those are really nice. I'm actually scrolling through the collection now. And diversity is remarkable. I like also the ones where it's like a grid of like maybe five by four individual lodge letters, it kind of looks like the sheet that when you go get your eyes checked, the optometrist asked you to read out from

Jaime:

number 19, specifically, maybe

Roy:

95. For that one. I can scroll back up. And yes, it really does have a diverse amount of outputs yet, actually, 19 is really nice, because it's got the colors.

Jaime:

Yeah, I'm looking at 95. Now, that article ones might be appealed to me, because I do sort of read a lot of magazine articles. And it just is evocative to me of that. And there's something interesting, like, I don't know, it's it is interesting to be shown something that your brain is basically reading as letters, but they are not letters. It reminds me a little bit of the stuff from that book Phantoms in the brain that I read so long ago. Yeah, like that, that would get me way sidetracked.

Roy:

It's also cool, as you were saying before, how some of them just, they blend together and they just look like patents and like you can't even really tell what it's letters. It's just like, cool generative art.

Jaime:

It's, it's, it's like not at all letters at some point, once it gets to the very, sort of that end of the algorithm.

Roy:

Yeah, all right. I am like officially liking this collection more and more as I scroll through it.

Jaime:

Yeah. And then so like, some of the more like, of the ones that don't look like letters. A lot of them are like sort of in a very specific grid like 184, I don't know where you're at in the scrolling. And that one, like doesn't appeal to you much. But then if you go just a little bit further out, like 191. That looks very interesting to me, and is, again, quite a bit different than that, even though it's again, all the way at this end of the spectrum where they don't look like letters that we're talking about. There's still even huge variety within that sort of area of the algorithm. Yeah, absolutely. It's, it's a really excellent job on the on the variety within the project.

Roy:

Yeah. But I guess the the just wider community at large doesn't value it as highly as say edifice at the moment. And so before prices are reflecting that reflecting that.

Jaime:

Yeah, it does seem to me like the kind of thing that like, again, people that are into typography, linguist, stuff like that, will eventually stumble upon it and fall in love. And you'll find a lot of people that are Yeah, very excited to collect a single piece or multiple pieces, purely for the love of the art. Whereas obviously, in the immediate aftermath of any curator project, regardless of the quality of the art, you just have a ton of people that were in it for the flips, and then if there just isn't the immediate demand from other people here I'm looking at one where they're all like crescent moons. I just keep rolling. But anyway, when when the demand isn't immediately there, the the flippers turned into it. Under cutters, yeah. And it just cascades like that. But raised to the bone out through this scrolling, we've both sort of gained an appreciation for it. And we the price, thanks to those under cutters probably are offering us a very attractive entry point to just find a piece you want to own as a collector. Yeah,

Roy:

I mean, point five, five for a curated blocks is, to my mind extremely cheap. Because, you know, for the very longest time the floor was one eth plus for anything curated now. I mean, there is a lot under the one eth mark, but still point five just seems 27 bit digital, that is point six. I'm gonna look up crap.

Jaime:

This is crazy cheap. Yeah. on a relative basis. The other thing we mentioned briefly off air is that there's some level of similarity to the recent factory project letters to my future self just in terms of you're both basically supposed to be evocative of writing, but are not things that you can actually read. Although sort of the somatic and design elements that underpin the two projects are quite a bit different. That there is something similar there.

Roy:

Yep, it seems like this is basically the second cheapest curated at the moment, this crypto blog 2.5. And then disappoint five, five, so I might have to go shopping a little bit later.

Jaime:

Me I actually just minted my first art block stuff in a while. I mean, two to three projects, I got a cocaina and a recursion, those were two of the currently open factory projects that I quite liked. The recursion is point two, five, which is pretty expensive for a factory piece in it in a non bull market time, but I just I really liked the art. It reminds me of both the art that I like and the stuff that I make, in a lot of ways. So it just seemed like I got to get one of these, you know, and I didn't want the same thing that happened that happened with the humans, where I wanted one set, I was going to get it and then like basically woke up one day and it was printed out and I was like oh shit that I missed my chance.

Roy:

Yeah. Rachel loves the cocaine is she's she's minted nine now, I think. And she sold one of them. So she still has eight. And I agree. Is a lot. They look stunning. They really do. Yeah, very nice collection. Yeah, definitely pop as the would love to have it hanging on my wall test out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jaime:

And like for a lot of that stuff where it hasn't melted out, it does seem like from a pure collector standpoint, it it would be smarter in a lot of ways to just go to the secondary market and try and find one specifically that you like. But I do like the idea of supporting our blocks and these creators, so I'm just, I'm more inclined to then do that when the project is not sold out already.

Roy:

Yeah, plus, the fun element of not knowing what you're getting. There's the gamble, randomness, lot. Vending Machine thing, that snowflake is always talking about why

Jaime:

I came into this conversation being so much less interested in the seminar project than I am now after scrolling through it a lot. It's a lot more interesting and pleasantly diverse than I understood before. Yes, a lot of them look better than I had sort of just assumed when I only saw a very small handful of them.

Roy:

I find that with a lot of collections, like especially if we go back to three months ago, or whenever it was four months when there were again, tons of open projects, I would you know, I'd look like click through a bunch of them look at like the very first output and read a little bit of blurb. And if you didn't immediately catch me, I was like, I'd really love this, maybe I'd look at the collection and look at eight, just at a snapshot a thumbnails. And the time would pop your mind start sailing out, get more attention someone else talks about, I'll go back and I'll actually start scrolling through I look at the live view and if it's interactive play with it. And like really just loving and appreciating the collection so much more, once you put the time into actually look at it and understand it and think about it. Which is it's just cool.

Jaime:

Yeah, yeah, you know what this is also actually giving me more of an appreciation for the new artbox website because I think this is the first time that I've used it and felt a clear benefit and preference to this format than any other where I'm just endlessly able to scroll through this entire project. And just see and appreciate the diversity of the algorithm. That's that's the thing with these generative projects is that people need to don't need to, but it can be helpful to think about the project's much more on an overall basis rather than an individual basis. Because that, you know, ultimately, in some respects, the art is the code, right? The only thing that the artist has created is the code. And then what you're seeing is the output from the code, but you're not really seeing like if you just see one picture for instance, For a drop of 1000, you're not at all seeing the whole thing unless it's a poorly designed algorithm, I guess in which case, that's a different story. But you need to really see it within the context of all the other pieces to gain sort of a full appreciation for what all of the art is. And then also for what that individual piece that you sort of looked at, and we're judging without the context of how it differs from the rest of the project, and how it's similar to the rest of the project. Yeah, that's, that's this new format of the website is actually quite good for that in a way that I was not appreciating so much before. There's like, very moment.

Roy:

Yeah, no, I would agree with that as well. I think it the website is definitely better for viewing the art, which, I mean, isn't that kind of what it's all about it? Yes. There are some improvements that I think could be made to the website. And you know, it's still a, it's been out for a couple of months. So maybe the able to upgrade and work on a couple of UI UX improvements. But this particular aspect is great. And you're absolutely right about viewing the entire collection as a whole because generative art prior to blockchain Tech was much like largely the case that the artist would generate hundreds 1000s of iterations and then pick a bunch and those would be, you know, what were sold or shown off, but they were

Jaime:

just nowadays, picking the ones that they considered Grails. Exactly.

Roy:

And now they just people are buying all of them. And the value is if the there is diversity is so fucking

Jaime:

amazing. I love this. I was I was also busy when I was mentoring as Yeah, I haven't shut up on this podcast lately about how busy I've been lately. But another one where I was busy.

Roy:

Yeah. Shit. I'm scrolling through, I'm down to 500. Now, and yeah, it's also gonna say, yeah, no, being able to have an algorithm a piece of code that can generate 1000, or 980. I think this is outputs that are unique enough, or like, unique and different enough from one another. While also clearly being from the same collection. And I mean, that is impressive. The next level is if each individual standalone piece also looks fantastic. And that's where you get things like fidenza, where I mean, I can definitely see people, I mean, looking at Seneca and saying, you know, I don't necessarily love half of the individual or 20% of the individual pieces, but I can appreciate the collection and diversity and stuff. Whereas with a fidenza, or a edifice, it's really a case over sub scape. Most people love almost every single output, and it really appeals on that level. And that's sort of the next level of it.

Jaime:

Yeah, and it kind of also works in the other direction. Like I was saying how I just meant to these two factory projects, there was another one where just the very first image on the project, like just the the page that shows you all the different projects, the one image they showed me from it, I quite liked it. So I opened up the project in a separate tab with sort of plans to to have, it'd be one of the ones I minted. But then basically all the outputs were so similar that even though looking at any individual, one of them, I would go, this looks like a piece of art that I appreciate the fact that it is generative art. And to me, the art is sort of the code and the overall project, it sort of devalued the individual, because it wasn't a separate output to me enough from the other ones, enough that I even wanted to terminate one at that point, because I already knew what I was going to get. And it was not going to be individual in a discernible way to the other ones. Yeah, I really started to appreciate that concept so much more when I heard Dimitri on our blocks, minutes after determines, rather the art blocks video podcast, he was really talking about how much he sort of demands diversity and variety within a generative algorithm. And it was obviously something that was a part of my framework for it, but it's become much more of a, you know, major guiding, just way of understanding and appreciating generative art as a differentiated type of art from the rest of it is really wanting to see great variety within the same algorithm.

Roy:

Yeah, 100% one I just stumbled upon that I really like it looks very different is 576. I don't know where you're up to and scrolling. But it looks like the text is like right to left as opposed to left to right. And the background. I don't think I've seen too many with this green background.

Jaime:

Y'all I was just looking at number 13 was kind of interesting to me. I obviously already saw that one if you're just yelling down.

Roy:

I'm gonna say this is for sale.

Jaime:

Yeah, I'm gonna definitely be shopping for these soon, actually.

Roy:

Yeah. Okay, um, number 576, currently earned by six, five to nine Museum. Ah, that it was. Yeah, so punk city.

Jaime:

Buy it. Now he bought it for 3.3 40. That's funny. So as soon as you have good taste, maybe yeah,

Roy:

I guess so. Um, yeah, that is really funny. It doesn't do it doesn't appear to be especially rare either. Looking at the trades,

Jaime:

do you want to talk about art blocks in a more general sense right now now that we're kind of just having fun talking about generative art in our blocks, just in terms of how the bear market has been bigger than the overall NFT bear market? Why we think that is what we think about the future. Like, do you want to get into any of that? Yeah, no, no, you're saying you're on the 10th.

Roy:

I've got about 20 minutes left, so we can chat. And yeah, it certainly has been our block has been hit harder than than the regular or the rest of the NFC market. I think for a few reasons. Started, I think it just it had more of a blow off top and it ran out.

Jaime:

It had the bowl was crazier for sure. than the other stuff. And and it got really crazy at the at the very tail end of it in a way that the other stuff did. And even though everything was booming really hard. It was going like every project was going up 40% a day for ages. It was yeah,

Roy:

the dino pal floor was like 150/8.

Jaime:

Right. I'm sort of thinking, like of projects that I was following specifically, I just remember getting into 720 minutes when the floor was like point seven. And it kind of just steadily went up to like four and a half ish. Like, and I mean steadily as in quickly, because we were in the beginnings of that bull market where we had sort of the institutional money and Vincent van Gogh coming in. But then it just went parabolically up to like 18. Overnight, it seemed almost and that that was when, you know, the art blocks was really outpacing the market, which was already, you know, the market itself was already going at such a high rate of speed that it made the pullback, the sort of inevitable pullback prone to be so much stronger in our blocks.

Roy:

Yeah, I definitely think that is a contributing factor to the the massive crash that we've seen another big one? Well, that's really a few that one is just the the, I guess the rate of new projects, which I think is slightly higher than what it used to be, even though we've had periods where there's tons of projects open before, I do think that they're launching a few more projects per week now than they did say five months ago, because they've increased the onboarding process and stuff like that,

Jaime:

just mathematically, the rate that new playground projects can appear. Yeah, yeah, has to go up as you have more curated artists. Yeah.

Roy:

It's also I think, for a long time, over the last couple months, artists were just sort of as a default, dropping collection sizes of 1000. Just because they were selling out 1000. And right. Before that, that was not the case, we will get 500, we will get 350 64 in some cases 100. And then now like the last week or two, we're starting to see more projects drop with less than 1000 as a result of that, but I think one of the other big contributing factors that we've spoken about before is how on open sea, they sort of split up the collections within curated and playground, to the individual collections, like project name by the artist. So like, on the one hand, it's great, it's more exposure for the artist. And there's more accuracy, in terms of if you want to look at a collection and like see re traits, the traits breakdown. Is there like you can see true representations. I

Jaime:

don't want to explain specifically how it used to be tricky for people.

Roy:

Yeah. So before you would have every curated project under this one collection on up on open sea called up looks curated. And then let's say you had I'll use a semoga as an example. I'm looking at it right now. And it says for green backgrounds, we were just talking about there is a point nine 3% chance of one of these assemblers having a green background. And that is correct that that does nine out of 980 or whatever. Maybe I got that wrong anyway, there is it's roughly correct before it was because every collection was grouped together. It would be okay there's nine green backgrounds out of the entire uploads curated, so it always be like point or 1% point or 2% for like

Jaime:

your trade or numerators for the traits were always correct, but the denominators were much, much bigger. So the percentage that they showed you every single trade, every single trait of every single project was was showing you a percentage that made it seem like a much, much, much rarer trait than it really was.

Roy:

And so yes, so the change in that respect is nice. But the downside is that it is much more difficult for a a newcomer to necessarily find out about up looks, because previously, if you look at sort of the whole, the stats and the ranking page, and subjects and stuff, yeah, you'd have up looks curated and playground always near the top because if hundreds if 1000s of eth is being traded, then it's up there with like, currently, I'm looking at the top this boy Daviau club, viewed Nevio club crypto punk sandbox doodles at the top five, almost always up looks curated, we'd be up there. But now because you have individual collections, I can see that edifice by Ben Kovac is 13th. So that's one curated drop, it's 13th on the overall list. But if they combined, you know, all curated, then it would probably be in the top few newcomers would see this up there with bored aged me names and be like, huh, art blocks, what is that? Let me go research it a bit and find out and look through the collection. And it's like, you know, uploads isn't really advertised. It's not like the communities out there prophesizing about it. It's not like as bad as it is difficult way to advertise in the NFT space and get new people to find out about your collection. And yeah, for better or worse, a lot of people find out about collections by looking at the the block stats ranking page, and I think that is hurting the secondary. Sorry, yeah, the the occupancy rankings page and that aside in the secondary market. So yeah, that's it's probably a short ish term issue, I think as just generally as more traffic moves away from open sea and onto Coinbase and other marketplaces. Yeah, our blocks will be advertised elsewhere and people find out about it from other ways and, and stuff like that. But that that I think has also contributed to the bearishness of the market.

Jaime:

Yeah, you know, what, you know, what else I do see that, it seems if you look at the floor of most NFT projects, and if you look at the floor of most art blocks, projects, I feel like the floors for our blocks projects are almost universally a lot steeper, because there's, especially right now, a lot less FOMO. So when people are undercutting the floor, it's not necessarily getting snatched up immediately. Because arc blocks is, it's a little bit more for collecting or a lot more for collecting, I would say, than it is for just speculative flipping, then, you know, a lot of these, like profile pic projects are sort of almost designed for that kind of thing. And that, that means that you have the floors can kind of be artificially low, because people aren't as eager to, to, to just grab the floor piece, because maybe that's not the one that they want, and that that piece needs to find the buyer who's attracted to that one. But sort of conversely, you have a lot less pieces that are going Oh shit, they've dropped the floor to this. Well, I really want to sell my piece right away because they have a little bit more of a collector or long term investor mentality. So the the undercutting cascading effect can only get so low because plenty of the people are literally just happy to hold them forever, in a way where like, if you think of some very low end profile picture projects, like there's not anybody that's like our I don't think there's anybody that's like the I never want to sell my misfits or like whatever junk has been totally tossed aside from the market. Like it's just it's a very different thing. So the those fours can just get all the way down to point oh, one in like no time. Whereas a lot of these RP N like, you know, if you look at the floor of a lot of just other projects, if the floor is point four, there's like 100 of them listed between point four and point four, two, whereas a ton of these aren't blocks projects. If the floor is say, point five, you don't even have to get to the second or third row on the open sea page to see ones that are already one and a half or two ether. Yeah. So theoretically, if and when the bull market comes again. It seems like the for the immediate early jump of that bull market could be much more explosive in our blocks.

Roy:

Yeah, I agree. We saw that also last time with the bull market. Thin floors is just sort of a thing without especially when you start looking at some of the lower collection sizes, like obviously elevated deconstruction is the prime example. There's only 200 of them. And they're like the bottleneck to curated. So you would often see the floor go like followed by a curated set. Yeah, you would see the full price go like 2550 90 168, or something like crazy like that, right. and to a lesser extent, you have hyper hash is 369 of those and a mica like 568-910-1415, or something like that. So it doesn't take many to double or triple the flow price.

Jaime:

It's almost like if you look at the floor of like a curated project, it looks almost like the floor of a single trait of another avatar project. Yes, somewhat rare trait.

Roy:

Yeah, no, that's, that's a good way of putting it,

Jaime:

where there's not that many people that want to sell near the floor. And obviously, like, you know, we all know that floors are moving. And you know, if the bottom four or five pieces or whatever, you might have other people going, okay, the liquidity is there. Now. Now, I'll list my piece near the floor. Now, I'll undercut myself a little bit and stuff like that, obviously, you're going to see some of that kind of thing. But you know, that that also applies to all the other projects that already have a log jam of 100 pieces listed at the floor price?

Roy:

Yeah. What do you think is going to happen in the next one to two months? Do you think that we're just going to continue this sort of general bearishness trend on our books? Or do you envision a world where it just for one reason or another turns around and kicks often? No, no, no one can predict or whatever these things, but what's your Inkling? Um,

Jaime:

yeah, that is a very difficult question. I do think that, um, there was probably a lot of people who were excited to get into it, when it was just the thing for a while, that kind of largely felt priced out, and are going to become aware of how much more affordable the pieces have become sort of across the board. And the other thing, I think, I didn't quite complete that thought, but I sort of feel like you know, where I was going. As you get more and more projects, I feel like, largely with this sort of long form generative art that they're doing on art blocks, people, I think, need to sort of find one project that they're really into, before they kind of get excited about generative art as a concept, and then they become much more interested in at least looking at all of the other projects. And so I think as time goes on, you are just going to get more people that are in the NFT space, who are are going to just find the art blocks that really speaks to them, that is now likely a lot more affordable than it was before. You know, when when things were mooning I think there's gonna be more of that probably. And also, you know, of just the stuff that didn't exist then. So if people came, they went, Wow, art blocks is really big, maybe I'll get into it. Wow, it's also really expensive. And none of this necessarily speaks to me so much. If they come back now, not only are prices across the board a lot cheaper, but they also have more stuff where they can just find something that they actually legitimately love. So I think there's a lot of things that it has going for it to attract more people to it. And I think also the way that the the bear market in it was so strong. And the inconsistency of the ability to flip with a Dutch auctions, they've done a good job of flipping, I'm sorry, shaking out the flippers. Yeah. And so you do have a much more true ownership base where we are now. And so if you can just kind of grow that number, I think, which I think they will it, it portends good things for them. And I'm just gonna keep going a little bit but as new people come to the NFT space also, I think it is a very pleasantly differentiated offering from the other big NFT projects. Like if you're talking about what are the big NFT things, you kind of have like games and you kind of have profile picture projects, and I think a lot of people who are not on boarded to NFT's yet are just flat out not interested in that sort of stuff. And I think um, you know, some of them will get converted in on the profile picture project thing because I think those are way More interesting than a lot of people realize. But regardless, the idea of art, like people can get behind that. And it this, the NFT's, to me, are actually truly a superior way of collecting art than the physical stuff. Because the, it's just so inconvenient. And the, the space you have on your walls for art is just so limited. That being able to collect them in a in a real digital sense is like a kind of a joy and a great way to do it. And there's going to be even better and better ways for people to display it in this digital realm. So I think a lot of the people that are coming to NFT's sort of reluctantly, are going to find that art blocks is something that they can get behind in a way that the other big art, big NFT projects are just something that they're never going to really be interested in.

Roy:

Yeah, I agree with pretty much all of that would add that like, yeah, there's gaming, and there's personal picture entities. And then art is like a whole other category. Within that art blocks. And generative art is a different thing. But like there's one of one art as well that a lot of people will be attracted to and appealed by. But it is a lot harder for just sort of the network effect and the brand effect to grow that it also necessarily more

Jaime:

like yes, a human creating a piece of art is not a new concept to anybody. Whereas Truly, this this long form, generative stuff is so new and people aren't aware of it, or so many people aren't aware of it. And so like the people that were interested in art, they've just already had a chance to care about one of horn art. And definitely, of course, more people will come into NFT's and think of NFT's as a valid place to create purchase. Display, one of one art by artists, no doubt. But it doesn't have that added bonus of being a totally new thing that that you know, works. So specifically well, with NFT's.

Roy:

Yeah, I think, yeah, I love generative

Jaime:

art, and you even more so I would say love generative art in a way that regular art, despite having your whole life's chances to get into it was never able to grab you.

Roy:

Yeah, it's this definitely cool and exciting and interesting in a whole other way. I'm also falling more in love with regular art as well. I mean, I always kind of liked it. But I would never like very into art, I would go to like nice museums every now and then. But now it's at a point where I'm appreciating art more. And then specifically generative art, just because of how cool and new and awesome and exciting it is. And yeah, I think more people will come to see that and appreciate it. And like within the NFT space and outside of it as well. And I think art blocks will always be like the first big, great generative art platform. And I think that the curated section especially will always like be a blue chip do well, there is sort of that limits to the supply, both in terms of historically what has been released, say in the first year of up lock season 1234, the value of that should be looked upon, highly, I think, but also just going forward that they do control the rate at which they release. It's like never more than one a week, often it's just like two a month. And yeah, so like as demand just gradually grows for our blocks as a whole. The the supply for curated specifically won't necessarily be able to keep up with that. And like even like even if projects are releasing 1000 of them. You know, if there's a million approx uses people that love our blocks, that's just, it's just going to mean that the price has not supply. Yeah. And it's not a thing where they can just say I'm going to create an algorithm to release 25,000. Because the difficulties in creating an algorithm that can have that sort of diversity, like it's very difficult to get it's to be to create 1000 unique or non unique, like just different enough outputs that. Yeah, it's hard to increase supply.

Jaime:

I'm also like, you're talking about the how finite the supply is for curated. Would you be stunned if, like they just stopped after season 10 and said, that is it we have curated this generative art. We have created this platform. We've got broad exposure to it. curated our blocks is done now. We're going to sort of open source our code more and be kind of just encouraging generative art across the board. But we're we're no longer doing our own thing. curated a thing, we want generative art to be more decentralized than ourselves. And now curated is just fucking done. And there is no more increase of the supply ever for our bucks curated. That to me seems very possible, just the way that decentralization is so valued in the space. I think that it's it's, and I know snowpro specifically is very into that kind of thing, the decentralized nature of all of it, I could see him wanting to get the onus of being the steward for generative art off of his back and off of our boxes back and rather have them just be sort of the not the financier, I'm trying to think of another ladder fishes. No, not the plot. Well, a little bit the platform, but just the encourager, and sort of the inspiration for it growing at large rather than the house from which it all is created. Yeah, I would if that happened, oh, my goodness. Who knows how people would start valuing curated?

Roy:

Yeah, I could. I would be slightly surprised but not totally stunned, I guess to see that happen. Because like, yeah, it does. It gets more difficult as time goes on to curate new like art that is distinctly different from the rest of collection as of high quality obviously, generative art will keep you know, people push the needle forward and, and stuff like that. But yeah, it is a lot of responsibilities last slash precious lash centralization, exactly. On our blog.

Jaime:

And also like, in six months, how many how many applications are they getting compared to what they're getting now? Exactly what they were getting when they first started curating it might, it might just become unfeasible in a way.

Roy:

Yeah. But I mean, they can still exist, obviously with out putting out new curated stuff that they'll have all the artists who have done curated, they can keep putting out new playground projects, great for them. And then it'll just be the factory and they just

Jaime:

love to see more books. Like did you see the Genesis book?

Roy:

The one of Martha

Jaime:

No, there's one that basically just collects all of Genesis gen two and Gen three. Oh, no, I don't mean just like a high quality art book of all of them. Oh, great. Cool. Yeah. And then that Meridian one that Matt was teasing also was great. Like more of that stuff out. Yeah, that is so nice for just showing people in the real world and getting into it and just the existing collectors growing their affinity for it. I know that I want a lot of those. So I would love to see more of that and I'm sure we will.

Roy:

Yep. I'm excited. I'm really again bullish on up like I never stopped being bullish on Apple like my excitement is reinvigorated after scrolling through this whole collection and looking at cool art and then talking about the possibilities and all sorts of stuff so

Jaime:

yeah, I think I could keep going Yeah, I do have to wrap up in alright let's we'll wrap this up and I'm sure we're gonna end up having to talk a little bit more about it in the q&a Anyway cuz yeah I'm gonna questions are about it all right. Definitely are blah right what's going on with your one ether challenge.

Roy:

I like that ether Yeah. Ah, not a lot it is basically the exact same stuck in limbo stuck in stasis situation as last week and think the week before the week before that. It is yeah, like honestly, I haven't even opened the wallet in now what

Jaime:

does it mean to open a wall

Roy:

I just because of my

Jaime:

look at it on the Okay,

Roy:

yeah, that's exactly what I meant. Or look at it on the website and look at the check the value of it anyway, I haven't done I haven't interacted with it at all. Just because you know market was bearish now it's getting to be better but gas is still pretty deadly. And that's terrible for the wallet but I was in the driving factors. I've just been busy with other things. And yeah, I'll talk about my my NFT launched. I don't think it had launched last time. It did wouldn't have it did it had launched

Jaime:

well depends on what you mean by last time. What do you mean? No, I'm just realizing this is our second recording of this episode. Yeah, definitely talked about it. While it was recorded, but was that last episode or recording of this episode?

Roy:

I think that was last recording of this episode. I think on the last episode. It had not yet

Jaime:

come out and sound right. Yeah, yeah.

Roy:

It doesn't doesn't get messed up

Jaime:

our our recording time. It's not consistent. Then anymore because I had a crazy life. But I'm remembering I was

Roy:

Yeah, I'm sure I listen is like going crazy going Of course he was out No, it was it was it was in last episode, um,

Jaime:

because I was sitting in a different location and I was sitting in this location the last time we recorded for this episode, therefore it must have been

Roy:

alright. Okay, I'm moving on. Either way, it's been an exciting week having the NFT launched and out there, people have been minting it's just very exciting. The launch went smoothly. I'm not thinking I didn't talk about anyway, the launch. The launch runs smoothly. You know, when you're launching an NFT project you get a lot of fears and concerns and worries and stress that something will go wrong. Because if something does go wrong, there's potential for people to lose a lot of money either to gas either to a contract exploit this that the other also just for people to be you know, if the website crashes, you know, anything can be

Jaime:

watches are very frequently but absolutely

Roy:

yes, they are. Thankfully though, this wasn't like a hyped launch. It wasn't a you know, we have a limited supply. You have to be there. Everyone wants 120 1000 people and a billion bots worth of you know, people are going to be trying to mint in this website. It because of the nature of the launch, you know, the two weeks cement the the Genesis token and basically whitelist only and forever to meet the well, I guess seven days but a lot longer a month, and then one day for the 333 as well. Yeah, and so just launched at 1030. At night, I put a tweet now in the discord. People who wanted a mint could meant there were a handful who saw my tweet, and then just like aped in and mint mentioned and then we're like, what did I just buy? Even though I was like, you know, made disclaimers and was like saying there's no rush, etc. But by and large, I think people have waited till gas is nice and low or they put a transaction through, I can always see on the ether scan website, you can see the pending transactions, and there's always like, a few that are like put through waiting hours or people trying to save some money. Yeah, cuz there's no rush if they're not like in a hurry to mean something else. Um, yeah. So I mean, as of right now, let me pull up and see how many movements just so I have the exact figures, but I'll yeah, I'll say the launch was smooth. We had fun. One funny issue with the whitelist for the 333. Basically, in order for like for the code to work correctly, all the Ethereum addresses had to be lowercase. And the dev just didn't do that beforehand. So the biggest issue we had was people couldn't meant because the capitals in that Aetherium address. So they had to, we had to, it took like 30 seconds once we identify the issue, and then just lowercase all of them, and then people commit. So yeah, we've got 84 of the 333 Club tokens out there. I think I've given away 10 of I was going to give away 13 to various people for various things. So 70 odd minutes, which I'm very happy with. And the Genesis token is about. It's funny, it's 3.3k. Nice. And what's the word? Somatic poetic, almost something somatic textual incidents. Yeah. Sure, titular.

Jaime:

The title of it was instead of Zen Academy had 33, there, it would be somewhat titular.

Roy:

Yeah. Anyway, um, no, it's been good. It's been great. And I'm loving seeing all the new faces and the people joining the Zen Academy community. And

Jaime:

then we had, we had literally the full circle thing with legions kind of right. I mean, there's there's some sort of weird time circle thing happening professionally there.

Roy:

Yes, let me just say, I've been really enjoying having people joined, but like, just seeing the interaction between all the community members welcoming new new members. I love the job that all the mods are doing volunteer mods, I mean, it's amazing how helpful and willing to help that they are. Yeah, it's just I love whenever like, I'm currently still doing 10 things at once. I don't have the time to be in every channel all the time. That's why

Jaime:

I don't do try not like impossible mathematically or something. Unless you had 20 You know

Roy:

what I mean? Make sure that like all the posts, I'm up to date with them. And yet anyway, whenever I do stop by chat and meet people, it's it's a great experience and I love it. I'm getting on to the lead drones thing. So lead drones for those who don't have an online poker background. You will not probably not recognize him but he just was his An influential figure. He wrote a book multiple books probably on you actually referenced it. I think it was.

Jaime:

It might have. Yes. Last episode I was gonna say last recording of this episode. Yeah, that was not last very first poker book i i bought when I was trying to learn the game was winning low limit Hold'em by Lee Jones. I think he's much more famous for being the head of PokerStars. During its like glory days.

Roy:

Yeah, well, well, not head of PokerStars. But he was like the front man.

Jaime:

The puppet. bit while I was trying to say he was a real head. He was I don't know any better. You know?

Roy:

He was beloved community figure. Yeah, more than that. He definitely did a lot of you know, running of things. But yeah, like in the early days, I believe he was the one who hosted every Sunday million Final Table. He would be there who would orchestrate the deals and chat with them and welcome people and condole them when they

Jaime:

I made that final test. Yeah, for years. Well, I did not know I played it three times. He.

Roy:

I probably hosted it more than I played it. So I was sponsored by them for a little while. And as part of the team online and part of the, I guess, duties, we weren't very extensive. But one of the things was, you know, every now and then you get to host the Sunday million and that's doing what Lee Jones did for years. But yeah, and yeah, he then went on to work, I think with the EBT European Poker Tour, and a bunch of other stuff after that. And he just, you know, DM me on Discord last, you know, several days ago and just reached out and was like, Hey, you nice to connect and cetera. I heard you play poker at blah, blah, blah. And yeah, he's in my Discord. He's in Zen Khadem II and curious it is he I believe he he connected via Ben that one of the cofounders curious at ease. And then Ben mentioned, I played poker, etc, etc. And yeah, we were like chatting. And then like, did we meet maybe, maybe it PCA or something once that event, but like, we're definitely aware of each other, but hadn't met. And then now he's in my Discord. And he wrote a really nice post in there a few. I was gonna say a few days ago, I think it was like 12 hours ago. And it's just crazy how life comes full circle online poker, you literally talking about the book, the first poker book you read on our podcast last week, and then the author of that book is in the discord. Now,

Jaime:

that's really good. And on the site. I mean, I guess I can't speak to you, but where I first really flourished as a poker player. I mean, I was making some money on Party Poker, but it was still, it was still such early days, and who knew if I was really going to be successful, but then the way that PokerStars was able to really successfully aggregate a big supply of players and have all the software be good, and, and all that. And that's where I really started to be confident that I made a good decision. You know, it was it was just a great site.

Roy:

Yeah. It really was it. Yeah, we said it last week, it really probably isn't pushing it to say it was probably the greatest company in the world for like five years. Just the amount of money though making well online poker was booming, and yet the like, personal touch and the quality of customer service that they had, and the willingness to like help players and give back it was just amazing. And then yeah,

Jaime:

and it almost seems like they were kind of in the same situation that open sea has been in for the past eight months, or whatever, where they're just growing at an insane speed. But then everybody that uses open see sees all the places where they're growing faster than the actual, you know, bones of the company can handle. And so it breaks in places, and you don't get responses when you have issues and all that stuff. It was like they were in the same position, but but kept being so accessible and smooth. Awesome. Yeah. So this has been talking PokerStars

Roy:

I think that's kind of it for my projects. Like, I guess I was gonna release before minting ends for the Genesis token. So you have till Tuesday the 23rd If you're interested in minting 1.033, at Zen academy.io. And there's tons of information on the website about what it is. And yes, I have lots of cool plans for the future. But kind of this is it for the lifetime Genesis memberships, there might be time locked memberships in the future, who knows? But yeah, if you're interested, I would recommend either going to the website reading reach out to me on Twitter, my latest newsletter post was about it. There's a lot of information that I hope people can make an informed decision about what what is being offered what what they receive in return and what they can expect and hope for. And actually if you want to check out the discord if you check my pin tweet on Twitter, there's a Google form that you can fill out, which basically, you can request a read only access. So we've set up this role where if people just want to read the discord, either just like, quote unquote try before you buy, just get an idea of what it is, or if you know he can't afford to buy you don't want to buy, you just want to get some access to the information and stuff but not actually be able to post them. Yeah.

Jaime:

Good idea.

Roy:

I think it's cool thing. Um, but yeah, that has been Zen Academy slash my money challenge. What's been going on with your abstract of the day or, you know,

Jaime:

basically the same as your one eth challenge thing in that. Not much has been happening. I have also been crazily busy. And gas has also been a big issue with it. I, I actually just had somebody today. DM me on Twitter asking if, if I would put anything on Polygon, they started, they heard that I'm doing thinking about doing the tasers thing. And they heard that I had thought about the polygon thing. And they were saying they want to collect but it's just the gas is insane on Aetherium right now. So I'm thinking that maybe I will make the rest, till like 150 on Polygon before I stop it and then reemerge like a phoenix out of the ashes on tezos. But I have my tablet pen in my hand and my tablet is a foot away from me. I'm ready, ready to create. And this is basically the last thing I have to do today before I get to actually plop down on the couch and start making art again.

Roy:

What, what number are we at?

Jaime:

That's literally one question. I think the last one I did was maybe 136. Let me let me double check here though.

Roy:

Yeah. And last time we chatted you thinking about tasers is

Jaime:

I'm thinking of it very strongly, it seems like the best option. But I could be convinced that polygon is a better option. It just seems like with Kaizo 's, I would be going where the artists and the art collectors kind of already are in that. Whereas in polygon, I would sort of be trying to be blazing a new frontier. Almost that sounds pretty pretentious. But like, it's just it's not it's not the place for one on one art right now at all. And so to try and no, there seems like not a smart thing, even if it has, you know, some some convenience help or whatever. It seems like tasers is the way to go. Yeah. And and I think that website object even does custom contracts for free. If I'm not mistaken. So that'll be actually quite cool. And the first time I've had that, yeah. Oh, that's good. Yeah. But I also, I think I'm just I'm having to get an iPad because I want to get procreate so bad. I think I can do more, I haven't necessarily, like hit the limitations of the app I'm using. But I have definitely found myself doing things that is taking me 90 minutes to do something that literally I knew if I had the right tools, it would take me 40 seconds, maybe not even with like just a couple of different tools. And, you know, if I thought more ahead of time about how I was constructing the piece, like, I might not have had to do that. But the way my art creating works is that's not even really an option. Sometimes it just sort of, I end up here now, you know, because I'm trying different things. But yeah, it would be nice to be hamstrung less, and have I think the software's not even really getting supported anymore. So it's fairly buggy as well. Which is super annoying.

Roy:

That makes a lot of sense. Like 90 minutes to 40 seconds. That's a hell of a Yeah, I'm

Jaime:

trying to think of what I was doing the other day. And I asked my sister in law who who creates on iPad with procreate if she could do it. And so she she sent me a video of her doing the same thing that I was basically doing by hand for so annoying. But like I knew I really liked what I had. And I just I had to just do this grunt work that I could have done by just having more control between different layers with different software. No, that's it for me, I think, oh, you know what, I was looking up the number and we got sidetracked. But the most recently created piece was 137. So yeah, I would have 13 ago and I still have two custom pieces to do for the seasons. And I just started working on the first of the two the other day and I had already done some work on the other one, but was starting to take in a different direction. So but I should probably have those done within a week or two and then you know if I'm if I can get in into the groove again, now that I sort of have things squared away, after being out of my home for two weeks, I've been back for about a day and a half now, and I mostly have all the shit I needed to be done. So I can actually just start being a normal person again and get into my routine. So should be about just over two weeks or two weeks, before I have all that done, and can kind of sit down, get my new tools, get used to tezos in the marketplaces there and start creating some longer form art pieces.

Roy:

Um, I know you were sort of thinking about the idea of dabbling with like generative art is that still something to consider,

Jaime:

I still love it enough that I'm definitely interested in it. But I do feel like like, I'm just sorry, I just hit my water bottle I'm having, I'm still just enjoying trying so much random new stuff. Creating by hand, and I haven't found, like, you know, I think what will ultimately happen is that I'll keep trying new stuff, and I'll eventually hit on something, you know, as I've come close to doing sometimes, where I find just a form that I like working with, or a type of look, I like going for that kind of thing. When I when I strike upon something that I really want to be able to explore so much. But having to do it all by hand is just it's no longer the best way to do it when when we have all these tools. And generative art sort of becomes the best way to explore that look and form and combinations of colors and hues or whatever that that I'm excited about and having fun exploring by hand. That's when I'll be forced to to just get in the generative ditches, I think and do it

Roy:

makes a lot of sense. Yeah. Shall we should we do a plug section?

Jaime:

Shall we? That's that's usually what I asked. Um, I think that yes, we should. Alright, oh, devil you you're not gonna go first.

Roy:

We're actually I'll go first. Okay, I was gonna

Jaime:

pretend like you had been telling me about something really interesting. You said it takes like a long time to, to really?

Roy:

Oh, yeah, in 510 minutes, maybe there's some clicking and typing in the background while someone Google's and searches for things. No, I've been talking tweeting a little bit this week, but also just for months, about like the importance of sleep and getting eight hours of sleep. And an excellent book, I read that it sort of led me to really prioritize my sleep. I think I read at the start of last year, started 2020 is why we sleep by Matthew Walker. And I mean, I just recommend reading it, it will most likely make you understand the importance of sleep and really want to prioritize it, even though it is it is very difficult, like to get eight hours of sleep at night. For a lot of people for myself included prior to that even sometimes now. Like I'll be awake till 6am 7am him. But I if I wake up after five hours, I like put my mask back on I'm like, get back to sleep just because I know the importance. And I know, after having done it for so long, like prior to, you know, started last year, I would definitely have periods of my life where I'd like just live off four hours of sleep five hours of sleep, you know, but especially back in my online poker days, when I was grinding a lot and trying to get certain milestones. That's

Jaime:

funny, I've done the opposite. And when I was when I was playing poker, I always had plenty of plenty of time for sleep. But now that I'm in NFT space, I feel like that has been much more of a thing that has led to poor sleeping habits.

Roy:

Yeah, don't get me wrong, like 80% of the time I was I poke a play, I was getting plenty of sleep, but you know, all sorts of stuff. But um, there was 20% of time rather, you know, I'd go for like weeks or a month or two, getting less sleep than eight hours a night, six hours a night or something. And I definitely felt worse, like my brain just didn't work your body to browse like, I feel like my Yeah, and now I've just felt for a long time, they'll just firing on all cylinders. And I'm thinking better and feeling better. And I know that like in the long like I'm probably making better decisions. And I also know that I'm not like damaging my long term health in a way that you avoid

Jaime:

like screens within an hour a bat and all that stuff.

Roy:

I when I first read the book, I was very particular about that. Now I'm not as particular about that. So my sleep quality is affected. I do like the there's apps you can get that change the I think it eliminates the blue colors or anyway, it changes the human friendly and it makes it seem. Yeah, exactly. So you can you can try that on your phone, PC. etc. Yeah, so I do that. But yeah. And the other thing is, I think as important, if I remember correctly, is to have a consistent sleep schedule. So sleep and wake up at around the same time every day.

Jaime:

You're consistent. You're like going to bed at six or something.

Roy:

Yeah, I go to bed around, yes, between six and 8am and get up between two and 4pm.

Jaime:

Now, that was something I did during my poker days, for sure. I would I would have mine was not consistent, though, necessarily, but I did. I was sleeping about eight hours a night at all different times of day over the course of a year, it will just shift by 45 minutes a day very often, for a couple of weeks.

Roy:

You know? Yeah. Alright, enough talking about

Jaime:

I'm going to slightly copy you. I'm reading a book called The Great Game by Peter Hopkirk. I've been kind of bouncing around from book to book trying to find one that I'll stick with now that I'm happy to stop reading books if they don't capture my attention. And I've been looking for a good history book, and I finally found one, it's called, again, the great game by Peter Hopkirk. It's basically about in the 1800s, when Britain Britain was worried about Russia extending their empire south towards India, and all of the ways that Britain and Russia basically battled and maneuvered for control of Central Asia to you know, make that happen or prevent that from happening. And it's, it's quite good as well, right? And it's interesting. So if you're looking for a history book, that's a good one.

Roy:

There's two books from Two Bored Apes.

Jaime:

This has been episode 15 of Two Bored Apes

Roy:

Thanks for listening.

Intro:

Two Bored Apes, talking NFT's, De-fi, and some random stuff! uh uh uh uh Two Bored Apes, talking NFT's, De-fi, and some random stuff! uh uh uh uh